Not sure how much I will write in response to your email. I have
banged heads with those who do not believe that God will fulfill His
promises to the nation of Israel before, and some of my thoughts on
why God will fulfill all His promises to the nation of Israel, and
the city of Jerusalem, can be found here if you are interested:
would like to point out a few things however as it seems to me that
your “proof” verses below are full of assumptions, not facts. That
is how it seems to me at least. I’ll just list them in the numbers
that you have assigned to your ‘facts”.
1. The only passage I could find in the Old Testament that says
that Jerusalem would lose the light of the lamp was in Jeremiah
25:10. This is a corresponding passage to the one you have quoted.
Here it is –
I will take from them the voice of mirth and the voice of gladness,
the voice of the bridegroom and the voice of the bride, the sound of
the millstones, and the light of the lamp.”
Even better, it goes on to tell us for how long this would occur:
“And this whole land shall be a desolation, and an astonishment; and
these nations shall serve the king of Babylon seventy years.”
know from scripture and history that after this time, the Jews
returned and populated the land of Israel again.
I would agree with your first point that Jerusalem lost the “light
of the lamp” for the seventy years it was in desolation, taken
captive by Nebuchadnezzar.
I would agree that during this period of desolation the voice of
bride and bridegroom was absent from Judah and Jerusalem.
Unfortunately, for point 3 you then make a big leap based on a
faulty assumption and say that Jerusalem will never get this back.
This is unfortunate because:
a) There is nothing in the Jeremiah passage that states that this
desolation was forever. The opposite is actually true. There are
many prophecies in the book of Jeremiah which show that that this
period of desolation in Babylon was for a limited time and that God
would restore Israel from this time of Judgement. Please read
Jeremiah 29:10-14, 30:1-3, 33:5-13.
b) Just because Jeremiah said that the sound of the bride and
bridegroom would be absent from Judah during this time of judgement,
and Babylon also loses the sound of bride and bridegroom in the
future, therefore you conclude that Jerusalem must be Babylon! Huge
assumption which leads to a faulty conclusion. Mystery Babylon
of Revelation 17 and 18 is not Israel, Jerusalem or Judah. It dates
back to even before there was a nation of Israel or a city called
Jerusalem! It dates back to the tower of Babel in Genesis 11. Even a
quick reading of Revelation 18:9-17 would show that its not
Jerusalem. All the merchants of the world mourn over Babylon’s fall
because it is a center of commerce. This is not the case with
Jerusalem, nor would merchants mourn over her fall. In fact,
Zechariah tells us that instead of mourning for Jerusalem, all
nations of the earth will come against her to destroy her (Zech 14)
and that the Lord will fight for her and then set up his Kingdom
rule from there (Zech 14:3, 16-20).
c) The prophecies concerning Babylon in Revelation were first spoken
by the Old Testament prophets and there is no way that “Babylon is
Jerusalem”. For example, see Jeremiah 50,51. Babylon will fall for
the slain of Israel (Jer 51:49).
4. Yes, the final fulfilment of Babylon’s fall as stated in
Revelation is still future and Babylon is not Jerusalem, nor Israel.
5. Again, faulty assumption. If you really like and believe
Jeremiah, then agree with his prophecy concerning the nation of
Jer 31:35-37 “This is what the LORD says, he who appoints the sun to shine by day, who
decrees the moon and stars to shine by night, who stirs up the sea
so that its waves roar— the LORD Almighty is his name: “Only
if these decrees vanish from my sight,” declares the LORD, “will the
descendants of Israel ever cease to be a nation before me.” This
is what the LORD says: “Only if the heavens above can be measured
and the foundations of the earth below be searched out will I reject
all the descendants of Israel because of all they have done,”
declares the LORD. “
6. Jeremiah nor Revelation says anything about Jerusalem losing its
‘status of bride’. You are reading into the text what isn’t even
there. Jeremiah just says that people aren’t going to be getting
married during this period of judgement. There won’t be the voice of
the bride or the bridegroom because they were taken into captivity
in Babylon. No where in the passages mentioned does it state that
they lost their 'status of bride' as you state.
7. I agree that in this current age, the Church is the bride of
Christ - composed of those that believe in the name of Jesus. But
this in no way nullifies the plans and promises God has made to the
nation of Israel and the city of Jerusalem for the future. God is
not a man that He should lie, nor the son of man that He should
change His mind.
Paul clearly shows that God still has a plan for the nation of
Israel after ‘the fullness of the gentiles has come in (see Rom
11:25). Why would God do this? Why would He still fulfil His
promises despite Israel’s failure and disobedience? Well, because -
“As far as the gospel is concerned, they are enemies on your
account; but as far as election is concerned, they are loved on
account of the patriarchs, for God’s gifts and his call
Why do I get so passionate about this topic? Because to say that God
is not going to fulfil His promises to the nation of Israel and the
city of Jerusalem, or to say that the Church now inherits the
promises made to the nation of Israel, is a slur on the character of
God. If He cannot be trusted to fulfil His promises to them, how
can He be trusted to fulfil His promises to us? No, He will, and
is. The Hebrew prophets said that the Israelite nation would be
disobedient and scattered throughout the earth. That happened. They
said that Jews would be persecuted amongst those nations. That
happened. They said that in the last days they would be regathered
and become a nation again. That happened. And it says that though
all the nations will come against them in war, they would look again
to their Messiah, the one pierced for them (Zech 12:10), who would
deliver them and setup His Kingdom from Jerusalem. (Zech 12, 14,
Isaiah 2). And yes, that will happen.